tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6845239886251312993.post3001696989157742429..comments2023-09-26T00:42:29.508-07:00Comments on Caritas in Veritate: The hermeneutic of priestly continuity.Father John Boylehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10581732723849634398noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6845239886251312993.post-80452231754754272132013-06-18T00:53:14.853-07:002013-06-18T00:53:14.853-07:00Priesthood is most-beautiful,
a most-rare flower
...Priesthood is most-beautiful,<br />a most-rare flower <br />which blooms in darkness,<br />nourished by blood and water <br />out-poured.Rachel M. Gohlmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13972993153075842439noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6845239886251312993.post-26099980446139253212010-03-20T13:16:57.107-07:002010-03-20T13:16:57.107-07:00Whilst it may not be a matter of ontology, there i...Whilst it may not be a matter of ontology, there is little doubt that the discipline is apostolic. Why should St Paul stipulate that men should only have been married once if they are to be admitted to the sacred ministry? Not because there were those in the early Church who were practising polygamy. Rather it was because a man who had married again after the death of his first wife was deemed not to be able to live in continence.<br /><br />Similarly, he was supposed to have raised his children in a good manner. This could only be proven once the children had grown up, and so it can be assumed that men destined for the sacred ministry and their wives had completed the child-bearing period of their lives and, since the conjugal act is primarily ordered towards procreation, sex would be something they would not be engaging in, or at least could live without.<br /><br />On the other hand St Paul had to warn the early Christians about the dangers of abstaining from sexual relations with their spouses as they seemed to embrace abstinence from such relations rather too enthusiastically.<br /><br />So, it seems to me from the studies I have read that St Paul encouraged spouses to be moderate and not to abstain from each other for too long. On the other hand, he indicated that those who were to be ordained should be judged as able to live a continent life.<br /><br />Sorry if this doesn't seem encouraging. I think you should allow the Latin Church its traditions as the Latin Church allows and respects the Eastern traditions. In that way we can live in mutual respect for one another. And it needn't be a barrier to full communion.Father John Boylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10581732723849634398noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6845239886251312993.post-60389608722343081482010-03-20T07:21:49.779-07:002010-03-20T07:21:49.779-07:00Father, thank you for your thoughtful reply. I...Father, thank you for your thoughtful reply. I'm sorry I missed it earlier. I don't think there can be any reasonable doubt that celibacy and continence were Apostolic <i>recommendations</i>, for all the baptised "able to bear it" (regular fasting from the marital act remains indispensibly part of the ascetical discipline that all Orthodox faithful are encouraged to follow to this day). I don't doubt either that celibacy is especially appropriate to the ordained ministry, for a variety of reasons, spiritual as well as purely practical, which is also the view of the Orthodox Church. Not clearly Apostolic, however, is celibacy or total continence as a requirement, 'ontologically' bound up with the ordained ministry. That, clearly, is a later development, absolutised subsequently within the Latin tradition. I note that in discussion of this address on a Traditionalist Catholic site, particular mention is made of its relevance to the "problem" of the Eastern Catholic discipline, regarded as defective on the basis of "ontological" requirement. Needless to day, this is not encouraging to those of us favourable to a more eirenic relationship with "Rome".Anagnostishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03706938507885553293noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6845239886251312993.post-4130997746184839852010-03-15T06:17:35.863-07:002010-03-15T06:17:35.863-07:00A very timely reminder Father, on the nature and d...A very timely reminder Father, on the nature and duties of the ordained priesthood!<br /><br />In the years following Vat II and the upheavals of the 60s the role of the priest became debased. Instead of being “ordained for men in the things that appertain to God” he was seen more as a sacramental administrator, liturgical presider and a glorified social worker.<br /> <br />Contributing to the formation of this view were things like ‘Worker Priests’ in France, ‘Liberation Theology’ in Latin and South America, a misunderstanding of ‘the Primacy of Conscience’ and ‘the Priesthood of the People’ from Vat II documents and opposition to <i>‘Humanae Vitae’</i>. This last also reflected on celibacy, as in: “what do celibate men know about married life?” – as if this were a new teaching and the ‘celbate old men’ were expounding a doctrine of their own instead of reiterating the constant teaching of the Church.<br /><br />In Ireland, where priests had been put ‘on a pedestal’ in the past, there was a sense of ‘bringing them down to size’ or ‘leveling the playing field’. And while some had certainly abused their position, the trust placed in them and the dignity of their office, many others found themselves ‘under siege’ and questioning their identity and role in the Church. Keeping their heads while it appeared that all around them others were losing theirs made for a difficult time for priests these past forty years.<br /><br />The misguided liturgical interpretations contributed to this and continue to do so – as the Holy Father well knows. As he pointed out in <i>The Spirit of the Liturgy</i>, turning the altar towards the people caused the focus to be on the priest and not on God. He was merely the ‘presider’ and with so many ‘functions’ being performed by laypeople, he became more of a <i>primus inter pares</i> rather than the indispensable element without whom we would not have the Mass or any of the Sacraments.<br /><br />The unfortunate events of recent years make it harder for good priests to fulfill their vocation. But it has never been easy and the priest will always be ‘a man set apart’ – not by personal ability, but by his calling and ordination. And <i>pace</i> the ‘women-priest’ movement, no one takes this upon himself, but only those called by God.GORhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14313101159848740722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6845239886251312993.post-14327105903270832942010-03-14T17:22:57.629-07:002010-03-14T17:22:57.629-07:00Moretben: thank you for commenting on this post.
...Moretben: thank you for commenting on this post.<br /><br />I think you are introducing conflict between lay and ordained where there is none. All the baptised are configured 'ontologically' to Christ by the seal or character imparted by the sacrament of baptism. All the laity are called to the threefold priestly, prophetic and kingly munera of Christ, particularly through their Confirmation by which another character/seal is imparted empowering the subject to carry out these munera.<br /><br />However, the priest is configured to Christ in an additional way that, as Vatican II affirms, differs not just in degree but in essence from the configuration of all the baptised. Priests are specifically configured 'ontologically' to Christ the Head. That is, within the ecclesial body, they occupy the position of the Head. And so they exercise their prophetic munus most especially within the ecclesial body. This configuration is ordered towards servicing the other members of the Mystical Body. Their 'prophecy' should be an 'enabling' force for the prophecy that the laity exercise in the world.<br /><br />And yet the priest's ordination radically configures him at the core of his being, and so he also exercises a prophetic munus towards all mankind in a way that is different to the manner in which the non-ordained exercise it.<br /><br />I think you need to get under the skin of the celibate to really understand him. As a Latin Catholic, I hugely respect the Eastern traditions. And yet I think the fact that I am celibate is a great gift from God, not just for me, but for my parishioners. I hope those you call 'Uniates' do not feel less 'Catholic' by observing their tradition of a married clergy. Whether or not celibacy amongst the clergy is of apostolic tradition has been the subject of much research. The limited research that I have carried out leads me to the conclusion that celibacy (or at least the observance of continence by the ordained) is of apostolic origin.<br /><br />The Church has always held that, whilst marriage is a great sacrament, the call to virginity for the sake of the Kingdom is, of itself, a higher state.Father John Boylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10581732723849634398noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6845239886251312993.post-62773974526671784392010-03-14T15:38:07.219-07:002010-03-14T15:38:07.219-07:00Father
As an Orthodox Christian, I read this addr...Father<br /><br />As an Orthodox Christian, I read this address of the Pope with great interest. Several things about it trouble me, not least the suggestion that only presbyters (and bishops, by extension), belong "ontologically" to God; that the prophetic ministry is therefore in some sense their exclusive prerogative; that non-celibates are somehow in imperfect "ontological" union with Christ. From an Orthodox perspective this looks like "sacerdotalism". Surely ALL of the baptised belong ontologically to Christ; are called to prophetic ministry; are called to witness to the world and to one another? This is not to blur the distinction between those ordained to speak at the altar with the "I" of Christ, and those who are not; but the idea that the former belong ontologically to Christ insofar as the latter <i>don't</i> seems disturbingly off-key to me. The particular context in which celibacy is addressed also makes me glad I'm not in the position of my Uniate brethren.Anagnostishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03706938507885553293noreply@blogger.com